Interview with Shao Tianlan of Mecaman Robot: On the way to the ultimate goal of embodied intelligence, we've already joined the game —— Niu Baiding
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Shao Tianlan, the founder and CEO of Mech - Mind Robotics, compares the eight - year entrepreneurial journey to "putting together a map". They focus on the eyes, hands, and brains of robots, hoping to adapt standardized products to a wide range of hardware forms to cover various industries. Shao Tianlan says this model is a process of "wanting it all", which is not only highly challenging but also difficult. However, over the years, Mech - Mind's products have been implemented across multiple industries and on a large scale in sectors such as automotive, logistics, and heavy industry. For four consecutive years, it has ranked first in market share, becoming the world's largest unicorn enterprise in the "AI + robotics" field.
Over a decade ago when he entered the industry, Shao Tianlan was almost the only one from Tsinghua University who chose to pursue a robotics major in Germany. In 2016, he founded Mech - Mind Robotics, aiming to take the intelligence of robots to the next level. In early 2017, Huachuang Capital led the Pre - A round of financing for Mech - Mind Robotics exclusively.
In today's era when everyone is involved in robotics, looking back through the rear - view mirror of history, Shao Tianlan finds that the current robotics industry is similar to the autonomous driving industry in 2015. On one hand, technological breakthroughs and progress bring great hope. On the other hand, under the bubble, many people underestimate the threshold between technology demonstration and large - scale implementation, thus setting overly aggressive timetables.
So, in Shao Tianlan's view, "Rather than paying attention to the noise of the surface waves, we should focus on the under - water trends." In the past eight years, Mech - Mind has laid a foundation in technology, customer base, and globalization through numerous tough battles. As a result, it has managed to join the game and secure a good position in the race towards the ultimate goal of embodied intelligence.
Recently, Shao Tianlan visited "Niubaiding" and reviewed the development of the robotics industry with Wu Haiyan, the managing partner of Huachuang Capital. They compared the technological evolution of the autonomous driving industry and envisioned how robots will enter thousands of households in the future. In this episode, you'll learn about the growth trajectory of a unicorn enterprise and the path to joining the game in the race towards the ultimate goal of embodied intelligence.
You'll hear the following content in this episode:
00:06:43 Trends in the robotics industry: Gradually being "kidnapped" by computer science majors
00:13:53 The current progress of the robotics industry is equivalent to that of the autonomous driving industry a decade ago
00:23:13 Entrepreneurial map - building: How to use standardized and universal products to cover various industries
00:31:49 Going global from the start: If you don't take the initiative, you'll be attacked
00:46:44 The fatal question in entrepreneurship - Many people underestimate the threshold between technology demonstration and large - scale implementation
00:53:06 Raising children vs. robot - assisted elderly care: Which is more reliable?
01:01:46 After eight years of entrepreneurship, join the game in the race towards the ultimate goal of embodied intelligence
Guest introduction:
Shao Tianlan, Founder and CEO of Mech - Mind Robotics
Host of this episode:
Wu Haiyan, Managing partner of Huachuang Capital
The following is the content of the program, edited by CGCVC -
Wu Haiyan: Tianlan, welcome to Huachuang's office to record this episode of "Niubaiding". Please introduce yourself first.
Shao Tianlan: Hello, listeners. I'm Shao Tianlan, the founder and CEO of Mech - Mind Robotics. We founded Mech - Mind Robotics eight years ago. After eight years of development, our high - precision industrial 3D cameras and artificial intelligence software have served many logistics and manufacturing scenarios.
We focus on the eyes, hands, and brains of robots, hoping that robots can have self - perception, planning, and decision - making abilities, just like autonomous vehicles. Currently, our products are widely used in many scenarios such as robot loading, handling, assembly, cutting, welding, gluing, and quality inspection. We are the world's first company to achieve large - scale manufacturing and application of intelligent robots in the manufacturing and logistics industries. We're also very honored to have received investment from Huachuang Capital at an early stage of our company.
Wu Haiyan: Your products have been widely applied in many scenarios, and you're the best company in this field globally. What opportunity made you see the entrepreneurial potential in this direction?
Shao Tianlan: At the end of 2016, I returned from Germany and founded Mech - Mind Robotics. In the past three to four years, our business has grown rapidly, and we've achieved large - scale application. The opportunity I saw when I returned was similar to the current situation of large models. People saw the potential of a new generation of artificial intelligence technology to enhance the intelligence of robots.
The landmark event at that time was AlphaGo defeating Lee Sedol. Meanwhile, there were also many advancements in machine vision, just like when we witnessed technologies like ChatGPT in 2023. In that wave, we founded Mech - Mind. Now, we're also leveraging the latest technologies, including generative AI, large models, and multi - modality, to further enhance the intelligence of robots.
Wu Haiyan: What changes has the robotics industry undergone from 2016 to now?
Shao Tianlan: The robotics industry can be seen as a process where computer science majors are "kidnapping" the industry. I studied at Tsinghua University for my undergraduate degree. Many of the original robotics laboratories were under the School of Mechanical Engineering. People thought robots had mechanical and control parts, so the relevant disciplines were mainly mechanical, electrical, including motors and control. In recent years, a significant trend I've noticed is that people in computer science, especially those working on artificial intelligence, large models, and those from other industries like autonomous driving, are "kidnapping" the industry. Now, people believe that robots are more about intelligence, which is a very obvious trend.
Wu Haiyan: In 2016, it was more about hardware or control.
Shao Tianlan: I think it was more about the intelligence of robots. Robots need to have good perception abilities to recognize thousands or even tens of thousands of items, precisely perceive their states, and have autonomous operation, task - understanding, and decision - making abilities. Since I went to Germany to study in 2012, I've been in the robotics industry for quite some time. During this period, I've seen progress in mechanics and control, but the extent of progress and the fundamental changes brought about are far less than those of artificial intelligence. Now, the entire industry is rapidly being AI - enabled.
Wu Haiyan: Let me ask in another way. There are many new terms in the industry now, such as large models, generalization, and embodied intelligence. These concepts didn't exist when you founded the company in 2016 or when we made the investment in 2017. What are the differences in the thinking of entrepreneurs and the industry between starting a robotics company today and in the past?
Shao Tianlan: I think there are both good and bad differences, but the industry is getting more attention.
Wu Haiyan: It seemed quite bustling back then, and there was also a wave of robotics companies emerging.
Shao Tianlan: But it can't compare with the current popularity. I graduated from Tsinghua University in 2012 and went to Germany to study robotics. My information may not be comprehensive, but as far as I know, I was probably the only one among the thousands of graduates from my school who went to Germany to study robotics. But today, such decisions are very common. When I went to Germany, robotics was a niche major, but now, it's almost everywhere, and it seems that everyone is involved in robotics.
Today, we see many large companies, such as Google, NVIDIA, Meta, ByteDance, Tesla, Tencent, Alibaba, JD.com, Meituan, and even automobile manufacturers like Chery and XPeng, are all involved in robotics. At the same time, we also see a large number of research institutions and universities investing in this field, and many startups are emerging like mushrooms after rain.
Everyone is involved in robotics, across all industries.
Shao Tianlan: Even many provinces have established robotics research centers. So, one of the major changes I mentioned is that the robotics industry is getting far more attention from government departments, investors, and large enterprises than when I first founded Mech - Mind. It has a positive side. For example, it's easier for startups to raise funds because there's a lot of capital interested in this field. The national policies also support it, and potential customers are attracted by the hype, so they're more likely to gain the attention of early - stage customers.
However, there are also negative aspects. Firstly, excessive competition starts too early. The maturity of many products is actually far from satisfactory, but the prices have been driven very low. For example, in the case of humanoid robots, there are five - fingered dexterous hands, four - fingered dexterous hands, and some even claim to offer them at even lower prices.
Secondly, there's a misjudgment of expectations. Since the technological maturity of the industry takes time, and startups also need time to polish their capabilities, build teams, and iterate their products. Due to the short - term excessive attention and expectations, people may set unrealistic timetables or have overly high expectations for technological progress. So, I think the current hype brings many opportunities but also many challenges.
This reminds me of the autonomous driving industry in 2015 or 2016. At that time, I was more of an onlooker in the autonomous driving industry. But today, I find that all the things that happened in the autonomous driving industry are repeating themselves in the robotics or embodied intelligence field in a different form.
Wu Haiyan: Compared with the autonomous driving industry, what stage of development is the robotics industry at, or what stage of product - technology development has it reached?
Shao Tianlan: The autonomous driving industry in 2015 is very similar to the current robotics industry. Firstly, technological breakthroughs and progress bring great hope. I remember that before I officially started my business, I saw many news videos about autonomous driving and the timetables set by many companies. This is a real trend that people can see hope in, not an imaginary one. We've witnessed many such technological advancements that can bring about things we couldn't imagine before. I call this the "early sign of success", and we can truly see a lot of such technological progress.
Secondly, after many entrepreneurs, large companies, and capital entered the market, some people started to set very aggressive timetables. For example, there were statements like "commercialization in three years, mass production in five years", and many large companies claimed that all cars would be autonomous by 2018 or 2020.
Looking back at today, a decade later, assisted driving has been basically popularized in cars priced over 200,000 yuan. L2 assisted driving and L3 autonomous driving are currently being tested in units of thousands. Leading companies like WeRide, Waymo, and Baidu's Apollo Go have hundreds to thousands of taxis in commercial operation in some specific areas, and the scale is gradually expanding, but it's still in the thousands - unit level. The actual progress of this timetable is obviously much slower than the aggressive expectations a decade ago.
Wu Haiyan: It seems that the robotics industry is in a better situation than the autonomous driving industry in 2015. The robotics industry should be at the stage of L2 popularization, while the autonomous driving industry hadn't reached the L2 popularization stage in 2015.
Shao Tianlan: Yes, I think the fundamental reason is that autonomous driving is a very serious industry related to human lives and safety. So, with the same level of technological maturity, the application of the robotics industry is broader than that of autonomous driving because of the higher safety threshold in autonomous driving.
From observing the autonomous driving industry, I've learned two things: Firstly, the most aggressive timetables promoted by people are almost impossible to achieve; secondly, some companies will still develop during this process. Although the actual timetable is not as fast as people expected, they may develop through L2 or key components.
Wu Haiyan: Looking back from our perspective, since Huachuang was an early investor in the autonomous driving industry, many of our views are similar to yours. Additionally, both the autonomous driving and robotics industries are brand - new, which means the entire industrial chain needs to be reshaped, the supply chain needs to be rebuilt from scratch, and customer scenarios need to be developed from zero. The advantage is that startups and large companies are on an equal footing at the starting line. In fact, startups may even have an edge because they're more flexible. Large companies may be more advantageous in iterating on existing mature industries, but they may not necessarily have an advantage in brand - new industries.
The autonomous driving industry has indeed experienced several ups and downs, with many peaks of hope and valleys of despair. There were difficult periods when capital and the market didn't recognize it, as well as periods when people regained hope and started to pursue the industry again. The companies that survived have become platform - level companies in the industry.
Shao Tianlan: I think it's like ocean waves. When we're on the surface of the water, we see the waves rising to 10 meters one moment and then dropping the next. But when we dive 10 meters or deeper, we find that the ocean current is very stable. From the perspective of front - line technicians, the progress of autonomous driving technology doesn't have such big fluctuations as it appears on the capital side. It's just that people are disappointed because of over - expectations and over - promises.
However, the actual evolution of technology is relatively stable, although it also goes through some iterations. So, rather than paying attention to the noise of the surface waves, we should focus on the under - water trends.
The same is true for the robotics industry. As an industry practitioner, the only reliable way for me to obtain information is to communicate with those who are actually doing the work and then implement and reproduce the technology. If I don't communicate deeply with others and actually reproduce the technology, I can't trust the information from videos or papers.
As for the numerous online information and rumors, they're even more confusing. So, when the surface is turbulent, we should focus on the real technological and commercial evolution, including application scenarios. This is what I really want to be involved in now.
Wu Haiyan: Yes, the prospect of a future fully participated by robots sounds wonderful. Robots can take over many dull and dangerous physical jobs, allowing humans to engage in more creative activities, spend more time with their families, and enjoy leisure and spiritual pursuits.
From the actual progress of the robotics industry, as you mentioned, Mech - Mind's products already have many customers. In which industries will robots be popularized first? What will the development stages be? We 80s and 90s generations are most looking forward to the day when we don't have to rely on our children for elderly care and robots can take care of us. How long will it take for this wish to come true?
Shao Tianlan: First of all, my view is that relying on robots for elderly care is more reliable than relying on children. As long as people born in the 80s and 90s lead a healthy lifestyle, drive carefully, and avoid extremely dangerous sports, they'll basically be able to see robots doing almost everything in the future. In this sense, this day isn't that far away.